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Hi all. As you know, I'm a big fan of the ATC / ACEO concept, and want to do my part to make it something for bearmakers as well. To this end, I'm making a few to bring to my Nevada City show next weekend.
Here's my question for you:
What should I do about pricing?
They don't just come together in five minutes, so there is a time cost, and the materials are sometimes pricey -- I tend to grab little stickers and transparent phrase thingamajigs and charms and ribbons for them, and don't just use what I have "on hand" -- so there's a small materials cost as well.
But I don't want to overprice them, which would defeat the purpose, and my wish to make them interesting and attractive options for bearlovers!
On Bid4Bears, where the market for them is growing, they are going for prices that fall all over the map.
So please, share your opinion with me on pricing these little works of original "art."
I will be packaging them in plastic resealable sleeves. Also, I don't plan to bring any digital cards. But if I did... what would a good price for THOSE be?
Also, this isn't an auction environment... so they should have a fixed price that makes sense and isn't up for negotiation.
I will probably price them all the same, but would consider different prices for something that's significantly outside the norm... like an ATC with closable "doors" or moving parts, just as an example. Not sure I'm going to be making any super-involved, 3D cards and such. But if I did... how would you price one of THOSE???
Toss me your ideas... any and all perspectives welcome!
Thanks,
Hi Shelli, 
You know I'm a big fan of these cards as well! I've been listing my cards on Bid4Bears and I've been watching what all the cards go for at auction. You're right....it's all over the map. I'd say on average though, that the cards go for around $5.00. I think that's probably a pretty safe price to start for a fairly plain card. The more intricate the design and "stuff" the higher the price. Just like bears! 
You're right, making these cards is not necessarily cheap. Cost of photos, papers, doohickies and thingamajiggies can creep right up there. They're an awful lot of fun though, aren't they? I've even been photocopying some of my really, really old antique fabrics and laces to use as backgrounds and fairy wings. I could go absolutely wild with ideas but I'm only allowing myself just four days a month to create them. Otherwise, there would be no silly bears!
I'll see you in Nevada City!! Please save aside one card for me as I'll be bringing some of my own along too.
Warmest bear hugs, :hug:
Aleta
P.S. As far as digital card go......I haven't got a clue! 
Shelli, I wasn't sure what to do about pricing either. I kind of followed the lead of some other and set a reserve of $3 since it was a new thing. But, I think $5 is probably more reasonable. Mine have sold on Bid4Bears ranging from $3-$26 which blows my mind. The funny thing too is that the price isn't always a refelection of the detail on the card. It just seems to be detemined by what someone likes and is willing to pay. As for the digital ones, why not charge the same price. It would take me as long to create one as it does a cut and paste. I'm not sure others would appreciate the talent required for photo editing ???? They may see it as just a "photo". Who knows ? I personally like both types.
I know that a lot of the cards on Bid4Bears have been bought by one person who is getting a collection to show her bear club students ( 10-11 yr.old) . She wants them to try making some. She mentioned to me that she probabaly has enough now, so you may see the bidding a bit slower on Bid4Bears, but I hope not !
Good luck with them at the show. Let us know how the cards are received.
Wild Thyme OriginalsShelli... here's something to chew on..... I haven't been following the ACT market at all price wise, nor have I ever made one ... so you've got the view point of an ATC "virgin" here... though I have been
the beautiful cards you ladies are creating!!!! 
Now, I know that greeting cards have really nothing to do with ATCs, but from the point of view of an uninitiated novice here, as I'm sure many of the folks that might be at a bear show as collectors might be......
My oldest son just turned 13 last week.. so I have a bunch of Happy Birthday cards on my mantle at the moment... and you know how much each card costs..... on average... most of them are $3.79! And we are talking about MASS PRODUCED, no frills.... Snoopy on the front, "Hey, I heard you are 13.... Happy B-Day!" kind of things.... no vellum inserts, no glitter, no pretty ribbons... made by a machine kinda things here.
So... from this gal's point of view.... "for a card"... lovingly created with beautiful bits and bobs, individually made by a person ... would I expect to pay significantly more than $3.79.... oh yea... you bet your butt I would! Add to it that it portrays a subject that is very near and dear to my own little heart.... !!!!!
That's the immediate price comparision that popped into my brain at least. Should they be way more than $3.79? The answer to that would be a resounding YES!!!!!
Kim Basta
Wild Thyme Originals
Just Us BearsI agree wholeheartedly with Kim...the price should reflect the fact that they are little pieces of art!
I have no idea how long each one takes to make but I'm betting it wouldn't be under an hour and possibly three times that long for the extra special ones. I'd be starting the basic ones at $10.00 and working up to $25.00 to $30.00 for the purttier ones.
But that's just my opinion...and what do I know. 
Shelli and Aleta...I don't suppose we are going to be lucky enough to get a preview of the delights you'll be selling on the weekend??? I so enjoyed Jenny's and Paula's pre-show parade. :clap:
Oh Shelli - I am in the same dilemma. I have just started making some cards for a show I have coming up. I have used lots of scrapbooking doo-dads on them and if you think you pay a lot for them, double or even triple the price and you'll get an idea of what we pay once they are exported here to NZ.
Still, they are so much fun that I am compelled to make them.
Delartful BearsI have kept quiet on the ATC and ACEO thing. I am been collecting ATCs for a couple of years now - before bears I used to do a bit of stamping and collage. So I have a large collection of them.
It boggles my mind that people pay for them!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I think a lot of "Old School ATCers" find ACEOS a bit icky, because really they are trading cards.
Having said all this, I have seen ATCs go as high as $30 - and your work is up there Shelli, so price at what you feel comfortable with! I doubt you'll find it hard to sell them.
It's just funny how people new to ATCs /ACEOs have no problem selling them, but people who were around when only ATCs were around, find it a little weird LOL
Danni
Hi Danni,
You're right. As ATC's were originally only traded, it is odd. I think perhaps ACEO's were born because collectors wanted in on the action. At least that is my perception. It's great that collectors want to buy them! I think to myself, "Why limit my myself exclusively to trading because I create and the collector doesn't." Does that make sense? Anyway, any profit I make on cards....which by the way is nothing at this point because I keep buying more paper and thingamagiggies....is put right back into making more cards. It's a fun little diversion from mohair and stuffing but it won't pay for my daughters wedding in August.
Creating the cards is a wonderful extention of bear artistry. What I derive great joy from is the original intention of the cards as ATC's......trading. I do that through personal contact. I'm trading with many TT'ers behind the scenes and taking cards along with me to shows to trade. I can't find it within myself to not include collectors that are not able to create as I do though. By selling to them they are then able to trade cards themselves, thus continuing the ATC's. That's my way of thinking......as goofy as some may view it!
Warmest bear hugs, :hug:
Aleta
Delartful BearsNo, no not at all goofy, and it DOES make sense. Just to me, it's a little odd - but that wasn't aimed at anyone, it was just a statement that I'm finding the whole ACEO thing hard to adjust to 
Besides, who'd want to pay to have one of MY bears on an ACEO? LOL IF I don't try it, I won't be shattered if I don't sell it - that could be part of it too if I were honest LOL :doh:
Danni
Wild Thyme OriginalsOpps.... i think maybe I got my terminology wrong as far as ATC vs. ACEO goes in my original post... I'm not sure? I guess I was thinking strictly from the collector point of view who walks into a bear show and sees them on someone's table and doesn't already collect the cards or make them.... what would "I" expect to pay.
I think it's a lovely way to extend the enjoyment of artist bears to those who perhaps can't quite part with x dollars for an actual bear. I know that I get e Mails from people who say, "I am not in a position to purchase one of your bears, but I do so enjoy seeing your auctions... just for the pictures!"
I think it's great! I wish I had the discipline to carve a couple hours out of the month to make some myself... either for trade or sale!"
ALETA!!!!!! Did I somehow miss that you have a daughter getting married in August? Maybe you had posted it before, and it just didn't stick with me!? Oh!!!! That's so wonderful, congratulations!!!!!! I LOVE weddings!
Kim Basta
Wild Thyme Originals
Hey gals... thanks for the support and input. I appreciate it, although I'm not sure I'll feel comfortable introducing a new idea like this with a price point of $30! I'm taking it all in, though, and thank you for being so validating.
I've done some reading on the web, Danni, and like you said, it does seem that the ATC originals and "purists" find the ACEO concept entirely "icky", as you so aptly put it! :)
However, as Aleta said, that leaves the artform open ONLY to artists and creators. People who really love the idea of having these little pocket art forms for their own but aren't artists, and have no artistic know-how, are left out, because they can't create pieces for trade.
This is why, I've read, the ACEO movement started up on eBay. Of course, it doesn't hurt that it puts cash in people's pockets! But I've been watching the ACEO auctions for a while now, and most of them aren't making anybody any money. They probably don't even sell for enough to cover time and materials... much less talent. So maybe it's not as icky as some of those "purists" actually think; maybe it's just another way to make art accessible.
Anyway... on other notes...
I spent most of yesterday working on my ACEO's for the show and managed to finish ten, if that gives you any indication of how long they take. How long they take ME, anyway. Laughing here...
I will give everyone here at TT a preview (or, if I'm too pressed for time, an after-look!) of both my teddies and my ACEO cards. I tend to set up my table (I say "tend to," referring to the ONE show I've done previously!) before I go as a kind of dress rehearsal, so I make sure not to forget anything important. And I always photograph all my bears before they leave the ol' nest.
I'm excited to trade cards with you Aleta! Bring it on, girlfriend!
Hugs,
Danni,
I would buy one of your ACEO's!!!!! So, get busy and make one! 
Silly you...I wasn't thinking your were taking aim at anyone. I was just reasoning the whole ATC/ACEO thing and my perception of how it may have come about. No worries!
Kim,
I thought I may have posted it.....but maybe I didn't. Yes, my darling girl is getting married in August! I'm so excited for her and I couldn't be happier with her fiancee. They'll be getting married here at the estate so preparations are going to be going into overdrive shortly. We have about 100 family members and friends flying in so I'll definitely have my hands full. If I'm totally off the map in August.....you'll know why! 
Warmest bear hugs, :hug:
Aleta
I'm testing out my first attempt at an animated .gif here, so you can preview my ACEO's... bear with me... not sure I can upload this type of file inside a post...
Aleta... you live on an ESTATE???
:love:
.......... didn't work. Will upload to image hosting, then link. We'll see... brb...
... DANGIT! Now The Seller Sourcebook is giving ME an error message (Server Down, bla bla bla.) First time THAT'S ever happened.
Well, I'll try to get them posted later. And here I was, all excited to share...
<pout>
shhhhhh. No yelling. shhhhh.
Warmest bear hugs, :hug:
Aleta
Who's yelling? I said POUTING. :)
Trying again...
AARGH!
NOW I'm yelling!
I can get the gif to upload to Photobucket, but the image is incredibly TINY. Why is that??? Anyone know? It should be, at actual pixel size, 3x4 inches. Instead, it's, like, 1/2 inch x 3/4 inch. If that.
AARGH!!!!
Apple Dumpling DesignsAwesome...both the cards and the presentation!!!
Apple Dumpling DesignsNow I see you have removed them...they were fine when I viewed them...not small at all!!!
Ooh, you must have caught it in the two seconds I had it posted. I removed it because it was so small. Was it super small in your view as well, Shantell? How on earth did you see it? When you saw it, was it 3x4 inches... literally? That's the size it should have been. This is my first time using Photobucket but my entire file is under their 500KB requirement so it should not have been resized.
???
I'm waiting for The Seller Sourcebook -- which is now displaying an EMERGENCY SITE MAINTENANCE notice, in big red bold letters! -- to get "fixed" so I can upload it at full size there.
Criminies...
Watch out for Miss Crankypants!! Isn't it maddening when you know something should work and it's not working at all? I'd be Miss Crankypants too!
Warmest hugs, :hug:
Aleta
Apple Dumpling DesignsAngels? I don't know :)
It was like what you would have normally posted only in slideshow format. It looked great!!! I'm guessing but about the size the my avatar maybe a bit smaller but not much.
I don't get it!!!! I could see the slideshow but it was incredibly tiny in my post... under one inch tall.
???
Quy where are you???
I'll try again... tell me what you see, if you would indulge me a little in this... I hate not understanding things that I think I already understand.
Apple Dumpling DesignsYep...looks fantastic...avatar size!!!
Ah... well, I reloaded my page and for some reason it grew to the correct size when I did that. It was miniscule when I first loaded it. It does appear to be "dithered", however, even though I specifically saved it without dithering. That's what makes the colors look funky and internet-y. Maybe it's a Photobucket thing.
Anyway ... I'm all done Rumpelstiltskin-ing now. No more foot stomping.
After all that to-do... Here are my ACEO's for the Nevada City show, plus the few I made previously. This will go on my website. That is, if I can figure out how to do THAT!!!
Laughing here...
I can see it just fine! It's really, really cool how you did that. Now I'm just going to sit here and pick my favorite!
Warmest hugs, :hug:
Aleta
P.S. My computer shows the images approximately 3 x 4 1/2.
Thank you, ladies!!!
PS to Aleta -- The ones that are already sold/traded are: TWIRL, BOYS, WILD/BOYS, BY THE SEA. The rest are available to trade with you! Hopefully, more coming soon!
