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bearlyart May 30, 2007

I would be very interested in people's opinions on something regarding sales (or non-sales) on eBay.  Here's some background first (or you could just skip to the third paragraph where I actually ask the question).  We last listed bears semi-regularly on eBay about 1 1/2 years ago.  At the time, we were trying a bit of everything to see what worked for us, and also what we liked to do, in terms of sales.  We tried eBay, our web site, other web sites, stores, magazines and shows.  With all that, we found that we liked shows best... we sold the most consistently, and greatly enjoyed doing them and meeting the collectors in-person.  That's all well and good!  So in 2006 that's what we concentrated on, and spread our show schedule throughout the year.  When this year rolled around, we decided we were lousy at extremely hot-weather shows (read: June and July), so dropped those.  What we wound up with was a big gap in the summer, from May to mid-August, when we are signed up to do Expo and TBAI back-to-back (yoicks).  We had previously decided that during that summer gap in our show schedule, we would try putting a few bears on eBay.  (I'm getting to my question, really I am.)

We're headed back into the eBay realm with our eyes wide open.  We know that we are not eBay-established bear artists, and therefore may be passed over for that reason alone.  Also, due to our concentrating on shows only this year and last, the majority of our collector base is AT shows, and not online... while a handful do cross over into both areas, we know from asking them that most of our show collectors are not on the computer.  We also have very realistic expectations of price on eBay, and neither expect big $$$ but nor are we willing to drop the bottom out of our retail prices... with our August and fall shows lined up, every bear can also just stay with us as show stock, where they will ultimately sell at our retail price.  With all that in mind, we still wanted to give it a try!  For a few reasons... simple curiosity is one, a desire to fill in between-show sales is another, and the hope that we can expand our email mailing list by putting ourselves out there a bit more.  Of course we would *like* to sell any bears we list, but we know it's not a given.  So (here it is, wait for it... question coming...)...

I have heard eBay referred to as advertising.  The theory being that whether the bear sells or not, at least you're showing people the good work that you are capable of and getting your name out there.  But let's say that, with realistic prices on your work and a squeezed economy, the bears you list do NOT sell.  Is that really good advertising?  I mean, would you think less of an artist who could not seem to sell a bear on eBay?  Let's say I listed a different bear every week for a month, or two or three months even, and none of them sold.  Am I really making myself look good by showcasing a variety of good bears, or in the wacky world of marketing, am I actually making myself look BAD if those bears don't also sell in a very public manner?  I'll be very interested to read the opinions on this, I haven't seen this specific question brought up before.

Bear hugs,
Kelly

Laurie May 30, 2007

I think when selling on e bay it helps if customers have seen your bears  at shows etc as they know what to expect but I am not that keen on e bay at the moment as I see that a lot of nice bears that look well made never get the prices they deserve where as others the bidders go mad on and they seem to pay a lot of money-I know they are lovely bears but the prices go so high.On e bay people want to buy the really cheap bears or high price bears but it is hard to sell bears in the normal price range.
I know what you mean where if bears don't sell you can make your bears look bad as people will notice they don't sell and automatically could pass them by thinking if no one wants them they must be no good.I would rather take mine to my local shop nowadays and get a reasonable price for them than forever feel that you are throwing yourself to the lions by going on e bay.I still get my advertising by the shop advertising me when they sell my bears.There are all the photos you have to take and the time spent listing etc where as if I go to my local shop that is all I have to do and I can spend more time making bears than time spent trying to sell them.Some artists don't like to use shops but you just have to find a way which suits you.I wouldn't rule out e bay but the inconsistencies of sales on there makes me feel I just can't be bothered with all the hassle of listing bears on there.You can come away so disappointed when your bears don't sell on e bay and it doesn't do your morale any good.
Laurie :hug:

psichick78 May 30, 2007

I'm not really an ebay seller so take what I say with a grain of salt but.........

I dont' think it's good advertising at all. There are soo many bears listed on there it's easy to get lost among all of them, including all the non-artist bears in that catagory.

Plus it's not like you can list your website on your auction either so people won't really follow you off ebay.

And yes, it MAY look bad if week after week your bears don't sell. I find myself wondering why some bears are listed so cheaply even though I'm sure nothing is wrong with them, I still can't help but wonder why they are willing to sell their bears so cheaply.

sarahjane May 30, 2007

Kelly...this very question is what I have been asking myself in recent times. I have been listing on ebay regularly since February, and while I feel that I have established myself as a regular lister I have had trouble establishing myself as a regular 'seller' and I am wondering myself how good that advertising can be if collectors are watching my bears go through week after week without a bid or even with only one bid?

So the bottom line is that I can't really answer your question but I will wait to see what everyone else says!!! 

bearlyart May 30, 2007

Thank you so much for all your thoughts Laurie, Heather and Sarah-Jane!  I think that we, as bear artists ourselves, understand that eBay can be an odd venue for things like sales and prices, but I worry that not everybody has that level of knowledge.  I wonder how many people would see a bear with no bids and think "it must not be any good!"  There is, I think, a level of psychology at work when people will bid on an item that others have bid on, but not bid on an item that others have not bid on.   I have heard it said, and I wish I could remember where, that the surest way to make money is to look like you don't need it.  And somewhere in all of that, I suppose, is where shill bidders crop up... in an effort to look more popular, or successful, in the hopes of receiving greater interest from other parties.

In the end, it is all a puzzle to me, but I don't mind playing the game occasionally 

Uh... I meant listing a bear legitimately, not shill bidding   

Bear hugs,
Kelly

I Love Teddies May 30, 2007

As a bear collector, I honestly don't buy from ebay.  I've only bought a couple of bears from there, and these were from artists I already knew.  I get too nervous, and if I've made up my mind for wanting a bear, I don't want to lose out on it.  Plus, I feel like you have to be there for the end of it and that might not be convenient.  There are so many bears listed and looking at the listings can be tiring (did I just say looking at bears is tiring?!     I think you know what I mean).  It seems like a lot of people buy bears from ebay so who knows? 

bearlyart May 30, 2007

Hi Chrissie,

Thanks for your input, it's always great to hear from a collector!  I know what you mean about the expanse of listings on eBay, it can be information overload!  And I have given myself heart palpitations before by trying to be high bidder on items there.

Bear hugs,
Kelly

bearsbybeesley May 30, 2007

Awesome topic. You know, I still have no answer.

I find at times we sell like crazy on Ebay and receive crazy prices for our bears and yet in an instant that can change.

I don't know if when that changes it looks bad for us or not! Probably.

All I know is that we are forever grateful for our wonderful sales on Ebay and yet we still appreciate our mailing list friends much more and always try to offer to them first. Even if that is at a lower prrice. After all, our mailing list followers are why we have established ourselves as bear artisits!

I don't know, Ebay can tend to make my head spin like a crazy lady!!  

Hugs Louise

rkr4cds May 31, 2007

I began this before my hungry bear of a DH asked what's for supper....

I'm not choosing any quotes in any particular order but commenting on a few, as I'd been on the show circuit for 14 years, in shops, been featured in magazines, entered all of the competitions, talked to my local Library/women's groups/Girl Scouts/newspares and now on eBay for over 5 years; anywhere that I could spread the word about the Teddy Bear World. These are only *my* experiences and opinions...

Also, due to our concentrating on shows only this year and last, the majority of our collector base is AT shows, and not online... while a handful do cross over into both areas, we know from asking them that most of our show collectors are not on the computer.

I found that there was no cross-over between show attendees and online collectors. Magazine readers/subscribers were the only ones aware of both worlds (our names, our bears' Look, etc)

every bear can also just stay with us as show stock, where they will ultimately sell at our retail price.

In the 14 years of exhibiting at the same shows every year, while still adding a few new venues, even I began to see some familiar faces - - among the bears! There were many bearmakers that brought the same bears to show after show until they sold. When a few sold, a few new ones were added to fill in that number of inventory pieces. If I noted that, I'm sure collectors did too. While it would be a collectors' dream to find brand-spanking-new work on every table at every show they attend, that's impractical. Mine saw each venue only 2X, if it was still with me after that it was donated away to GBW or similar organizations.

Most collectors do not travel the distances that bear makers do: they attend mostly the ones in their areas as perhaps a day-tripper; there and back on the same day. Therefore, they see only a set amount of bears, based on the # of artists times the number of bears per table. Online (auction/sites/webzines) our bears are visible to untold millions.

Of course we would *like* to sell any bears we list, but we know it's not a given.

It's no more of a guarantee to have the bears in a shop, on a site, taken to your office or seen on an auction site. It's pure luck in timing to be seen by the person that will instantly know that that bear will be theirs.

There are all the photos you have to take and the time spent listing etc

Matched against the time and expense—that hasn't been brought up here and it's a tremendous advance financial investment w/absolutely no guarantee of incoming revenue!—of exhibiting at shows, where the average show brings in several hundred to a thousand people (the Good Ole Days!) or being seen online through many avenues (Shop sites, our sites, auctions, webzines) I feel that taking the images and posting—which I can also do in my PJs @ 3 AM—far outweighs the physical 'down time' away from my working hours that're taken up with at least a day each way devoted to travel and the day(s) spent at the show itself.

There are soo many bears listed on there it's easy to get lost among all of them, including all the non-artist bears in that catagory.

Have you never been to a show where you could "no longer see the trees for the forest"? There are so many bears at a show that they become a blur there just as easily as online. Special ones that touch your heart will always catch your eye, in every venue, but basically there are just as many bears visible in person as online to the average memory.
We miniaturists must be fortunate, as Category 3904 is very manageable in surfing though daily in the newest listed.

I have been listing on ebay regularly since February,

Unfortunately, it's just starting for you, Sarah Jane. A year can be a very long time to a bear artist; a short time to a collector. Regular is understood to mean 'with a certainty of posting': once a week from Thurs through Tues, every other week for 3 or 7 days, once a month on the first Tuesday,etc... That's what regularity means to my list - they know approximately when to expect new work and check for it. There aren't as many collectors that are as loyal and constant surfers as we fellow bear makers are!

take mine to my local shop nowadays and get a reasonable price for them

Is the shop willing to give you nearly your retail price? All that I dealt with wanted a 30% - 50% reduction in price. That is the same as 'giving it away on eBay' to me. I did it for years and was glad for the publicity (which I considered it to be in my business budget) as the shops were overseas and in areas of the US that I'd not be able to exhibit in, due to costs, time of year or there being no quality bear shows there.

I have heard it said, and I wish I could remember where, that the surest way to make money is to look like you don't need it.

In my custom knitting business days, I'd said it many times. I exhibited in some of the very tony suburbs of Chicago: you didn't do well unless you dressed and acted as if you could care less.. a dilettante thing to fill your time with....

bearlyart May 31, 2007

Thanks so much for your input, Louise!

I find at times we sell like crazy on Ebay and receive crazy prices for our bears and yet in an instant that can change.

That's another nutty thing about eBay, isn't it?  I'm always happy for other bear artists when they do well, but eBay has also shown how the bottom can fall out from anyone, at any time.  I'm sure there's always a reason, but it may not be a very good one... like "well, she didn't bid on it this time, so I guess I won't either." 

Bear hugs,
Kelly

bearlyart May 31, 2007

Thanks for the great input, Bobbie!

In the 14 years of exhibiting at the same shows every year, while still adding a few new venues, even I began to see some familiar faces - - among the bears! There were many bearmakers that brought the same bears to show after show until they sold. When a few sold, a few new ones were added to fill in that number of inventory pieces. If I noted that, I'm sure collectors did too. While it would be a collectors' dream to find brand-spanking-new work on every table at every show they attend, that's impractical. Mine saw each venue only 2X, if it was still with me after that it was donated away to GBW or similar organizations.

Ah yes, very true!  I did not mean to imply that I could take bears to a show and sell out, as that would definitely not be the case!  I definitely do see the familiar faces that you mention from show to show.  There are *very* few artists who sell out at shows today, and of the perhaps two artists that I've seen in this situation, both had 6 or less bears with them at the time.  We attend shows with two artists' worth of stock, easily 2-3 dozen bears, so NO WAY will we sell out, nor are we likely to run low rapidly.

It's no more of a guarantee to have the bears in a shop, on a site, taken to your office or seen on an auction site. It's pure luck in timing to be seen by the person that will instantly know that that bear will be theirs.

That's a very important point, thank you for making it!  I do think that while many bears have a broad appeal (preferably among multiple collectors who both could and would make such a purchase), others need to wait for "the one" to find them.  And I wish I had that matchmaking information ahead of time!

Bear hugs,
Kelly

Aleta - The Silly Bear May 31, 2007

Hi Kelly, 
Consistency is key in order for Ebay to work as advertising.  All of my listings this year have failed on eBay, save one.....my highest priced set.  I have not been consistent in my listings because I'm concentrating on my web sales.  Even listing on my website, of late, has been a skip here and a hop there.  However, every listing that did not meet reserve on Ebay was scooped from my website at the same price within a day.  Why?  Not sure.  It may be in part due to the fact that my "Me Page" is linked to my website.  So, if someone was watching and missed the end.....the could zip on over to my website through my "Me Page".  That's my best guess anyway.

Also, I'm finding that some collectors prefer to buy outside of Ebay....even though they watch and buy another artist's bears there.  I don't do private auctions so I suppose this is their way of remaining anonymous.  Am I being clear as mud here?   

Just my two cents.  Take if for what it's worth.....a half penny!   :crackup:

Warmest bear hugs,  :hug:
Aleta

P.S.  Great wishes to you if you do decide to jump in!!  If nothing else, it makes you learn what you and your camera can do.  That in itself, can be priceless!!

sarahjane May 31, 2007

Hi...Bobbie, I am finding it so interesting reading all these posts.....I know what you mean when you said

Unfortunately, it's just starting for you, Sarah Jane. A year can be a very long time to a bear artist; a short time to a collector. Regular is understood to mean 'with a certainty of posting': once a week from Thurs through Tues, every other week for 3 or 7 days, once a month on the first Tuesday,etc... That's what regularity means to my list - they know approximately when to expect new work and check for it. There aren't as many collectors that are as loyal and constant surfers as we fellow bear makers are!

And that is so right....I have actually been listing on ebay since last year but only have said zFeb because that is when I started having an auction up every week at the same time...I do think that regularity is so important.

I didn't mean to imply that I didn't like Ebay as that is where my main buyers have mostly come from I just sometimes wonder if I am doing myself more damage than good during the times when I am not selling?

On the other hand I love making the bears and would fast run out of room here at home if I didn't sell at least some of them!!!     

FenBeary Folk May 31, 2007

Hi everyone just thought I would add my pennies worth on ebay, although I am new to making bears, I have used ebay quite a quite awhile as a buyer and sometimes as a seller

1 when I buy I bid in the last few seconds (bargain queen)

2 I don't care if there are no bidders on that item, I prefer it if there is non (no competition)

3 I do my homework, viewing all lists for the thing I want, I look at postage costs, feedback and what I am getting for my money

4 I make sure they accept paypal (can't wait to get item and the only time I paid by cheque the seller did not send or cash cheque!!)

5 Once short listed I view items on and off for awhile before deciding which one I really want

6 If no postage given I do not bid

In conclusion I have decided that I am not the normal ebay buyer

As a seller of various things in the past (car parts-shed clearout, jewellry etc) I have been frustrated, angered and upset with my efforts so far but have observed the following

1 Pay day has a great effect on ebay, at pay time alot bid on a few items (normally from the same sellers) giving great prices for a few but non for others, the week after payday when the great have been sold then the the bids are more evenly given to other items, half way between payday then very little bidders.

2 Sheep follow each other, I have often wondered and seen a sudden rise in a price days before bidding has ended, this I can only think is "they must know something I don't" mentality, I have seen prices driven up on purpose (not on artist bears but other manufactured ones) just one bid encourages the unsuspecting to bid

3 Reserve! I have seen identical items from the same seller sell for totally different prices, if you start low then people tend to bid even if there is a reserve, if the starting price is higher they will leave well alone and often the low starter will overtake the higher original priced item, even if they are next to each other on the listing, I have come to the conclusion that the thrill of the chase appeals to a large amount of people and for a few days they are the potential owner, the next person who bids then feels that they are stealing it form the original bidder, as I said before I am the ruthless one who says HA!! got u at the end. The only problem with reserves is that the odd one or two people will bid til they reach the reserve then retract their bid and the number of times that I have sold something that has just reached its reserve if often, alot asume (phsycologically)that the reserve is the value of the item and its not worth more

4 Listing twice, I tend to find that an item will sell second time around, this is often after the poor seller has lowered the start price, quite a bit, I have done this! Not anymore I realised that buyers would catch onto this quickly and hold of bidding til the item was relisted, I had thought like many that it was because I had priced the item too high.

5 Buyers who view an item or ask questions very rarely buy

6 Photos, obviously the better they are, the more chance an item has but I have seen the most out of focus bears sell, I think this must be "it could be a Leonardo!!" in disguise

I hope you lot can make sense of this because I can't even after looking and looking I still can't. The idea of it as adverting I thought was a great one but now I am not so sure, I do think that having a bear featured in a magazine is the best way to sell (my aim) and to do shows is something I would like also

On another point ebay Uk still in its help pages says to give your item more listing (ie in other countries) to offer  postage worldwide !!!???

Sorry if this is a bit to the point but I am typing like mad before I go to earn to pay the mortgage!!

I have decided that I am going to be true to myself (can't you tell I am new) for as long as I can!!

FenBeary Folk Jun 1, 2007

Oh dear, have I killed this topic???????????

I would love to now what everyone else thinks, if you agree or disagree

PLEASE

rkr4cds Jun 1, 2007

No you didn't, at least not with me. You have some very valid points; I added a few.
I wrote an equally long reply yesterday noon - and it never appeared!! I must've hit close instead of submit. I'll try to reconstruct later today.... gggrrrrrrrrrrrrr

FenBeary Folk Jun 1, 2007

Hi Ellen, I was very interested in what you said, I am new to selling bears and I am grateful for your imput on what I said, maybe different catogories have different ways, I thought you had a very valid point about established artists having reserves, where people know their work and I have also seen bears relisted with no reserve and then sell, I actually find reserves annoying and would prefer to start at what I wanted, I am not sure that I will ever understand how people/bidders work

I am glad that you are fellow last minuter, but I had wondered if that was why I find it so difficult to sell anything as bidding with 4 or 5 days to go is alien to me??

I was so glad to see that you think that it was good advertising because this idea (advertising) suddenly stopped me being fed up if something did not sell or had no bids, I also take on board that marketing /advertising is crucial, just wish I could stop the clock/not go to work as at the moment it feels like I will never have time to make bears at all

I am holiday next week (daughter doing GCSE's) so I plan to do alot including having a good look at bid4bears

Photography is not my strong point and it seems that it does not matter what I do with my camera it has a slight blur most of the time!! possible wobbley hand syndrome I think :crackup:

thanks for replying and someone who does such stunning bears could never offend, maybe if we all said how it works for us then maybe we could crack ebay but some how I don't think so :hug:

Ps don't you just hate typing a long reply and losing it

KJ Lyons Jun 1, 2007

Hmmm ...
First I have to say I love my eBay collectors and I list only special pieces on eBay. As has been said; my eBay collectors are not the collectors I have at Shows. And the designs I have for shows are not the designs I show on eBay. I, also, participate in many charity auctions and special show auctions. I think of an eBay auction in the same way. At most auctions the piece starts at $0. (With eBay I usually start at $100.00 because of this special case where if you start too low you piece will be FAR back in the pages). But as with most auctions, the reserve is not revealed. I feel this is part of the auction game. And I think, rightfully, so. An artist can't afford to take a loss if for some reason the auction is slow or if some calamity occurs that distracts bidders. Any fine art auction would have a reserve. And I'm a little put off when an auction starts at the reserve?! First I wonder what the artist expects in price when they start at $400? It just doesn't feel like an auction  I, also, feel the point is to get many bids and get collectors participating and excited about the auction. OK, I'll admit maybe I'm old-fashioned. Maybe eBay is nothing like a real auction? But it's worked for me 
Karen

edie Jun 2, 2007

When it comes to ebay, I just can't figure it out! I do know though for myself if I see something that is started low and not much action on it (and I want it!) then I will bid and once I have bid it is like I have already started thinking about owning it and will keep bidding far past what I would have just passed by if it were started at that price to begin with. So there is something about getting people started on bidding and then they don't like to quit! (Like maybe just one more bid will get it for you - whether it is an online auction or a live auction!)
I am really undecided now if it is a good or bad thing as far as advertising if you keep listing items that don't sell. There really is two ways of looking at it. I do like the idea of having my bears up on ebay or bid4bears so that lots of people can see them though! Perhaps as long as you aren't listing the same bear over and over then people will be seeing your work and when they see different bears each time they likely will assume you are selling them somewhere else if they don't go on ebay??? I guess the more I think about it, I do think that it is good advertising - anything that gets your name noticed has to be good! I think people might be more inclined to realize that they are becoming familiar with your name and work than to notice how much of it is selling. I mean I really only notice if something sells and for how much if it was something that I was really intent on purchasing - otherwise I look and think, oh how cute, and carry on.

FenBeary Folk Jun 2, 2007

Edie, I think that maybe that is the key to using it as advertising, list once or twice at the most and let the bidders assume that you have sold the bear elsewhere, what a great idea.  I think if my bears does not sell then I will remove on to a website (yet to be contructed :crackup: )

I have to admit I have not noticed if jewellry has not sold if I am not interested in that piece, I only watch the ones I am interested in and mostly I am then the buyer or someone out bids me with 10 seconds to go, but jewellry is a huge section, I suppose the bear catagory is so much smaller :hug:

Karen, you are so right it is the thrill of the chase and us bargain queens like to get a good deal (not something for nothing) but feel that you have got the item slightly less than the shop prices (it also helps in justification to the other half if it was cheaper) "but it was only.............."   I like the idea of doing pieces just for ebay, specials, but at the moment I am so new I don't have that many (2 actually :crackup: )

minkbears Jun 2, 2007

This topic caught my eye because there was a time when I swore that I would never do eBay. I've been in this business almost 20 years. I used to sell at shows, shops, or custom order. My bears regularly appeared in the magazines or in books. I had long waiting lists for my bears but by 2004 there were fewer shows and shops and I had filled all of my orders.  The world has changed and for a while I was not willing to change with it. In 2005 I stopped making bears and tried working at a "real job"  :crackup: 
Yeah, that was a joke. So I decide to give my bears one last chance and I gave eBay a try.

I totally agree with the inputs from Bobbie, Ellen, and Karen. I personally approached eBay with the attitude that eBAy would be an advertising expense and I prepared myself to not get any bids. But before I listed my first auction, I designed a new website, I made myself a good ME page on ebay to get people to my website, and I paid extra to list on Featured Plus so my bears would not get lost in the shuffle. My first sales were okay...I never felt insulted by the prices I got (I list with No Reserve beginning at $125 which is enough to cover my materials and expenses). For eBay I list only my very best OOAK pieces  that I design just for my eBay collectors and for me it has worked because by the end of one year of selling on eBay I started to attract some wonderful collectors who were willing to bid higher than I ever dreamed. But in the meantime, my work also attracted the attention of collectors who could not afford to compete with the high bidding but they put their names on my mailing list anyway. For those collectors, I now create and sell my limited edition bears and animals...which have been selling as soon as I post them.

The "eBay as advertising approach" worked for me because I restarted my business from the ground floor and it has gradually grown into a business where I once again have a waiting list for my work and loyal new collectors from all over the world.

So now I have my life as a Teddy Bear Artist "before eBay" and my life as a Teddy Bear Artist "after eBay" .... it's very different. I spent a lot of time on the computer now...but my new eBay collectors have been very very good to me.

I truly feel blessed.

:hug:
~Kathy

Jare Hares & Bears Jun 2, 2007

Ok so I have only skimmed this thread. But I am going to chip in my two cents.

1st of all where else in the world can you go and advertise globally for less than $30?
Magazines, Newspapers, Radio, or TV, No way.  Many newspapers, radio stations, and TV stations are limited to an area.  Magazines might be mostly national publications and a few are international.  But if you want to run an ad in these mediums you are going to spend big bucks.

I recommend ebay as an advertising medium.  Sure the first few bears might not sell or only sell for retail, I do recommend placing reserves.  But remember you do not have the expense of being at a show all day, meals, gas or plane tickets, shipping costs (if you fly), and paperwork.  While I think that it is very important to still do shows and meet the public, if I can sell something on ebay and still be working on bodies at home, then it is a good day.

Once you keep going on ebay I think that you will have a loyal following that will spend the money on your bears.

The biggest mistake that can be made is not keeping an updated mailing list.  Keep every buyers e-mail and address. And then use that list to keep in touch with your buyers.  Send out postcards, letters, or e-mails when you have new designs available.
When sending out e-mails, I do place at the bottom, "If you would like to be removed from this mailing list simply reply with REMOVE in the subject field."  Then I make sure to promptly remove them from my mailing list.  If I get returned e-mails or letters with no forwarding address, then I remove those names as well.  It does take sometime, but it is worth it.

I do use a e-mail newsletter service because our e-mail list has grown so much in the last 2 years, and it makes creating professional newsletters and notices easy.  It also makes it easy for people to subscribe, forward, and join our mailing list.  It runs about $10.00 a month to send out 2,000 e-mails.  While our list is big it is not that big, but if I need to be able to send out more e-mails it is reasonable to do so.  I use www.emailbrain.com

rkr4cds Jun 3, 2007

I've found a few minutes to re-type the reply I *thought* I sent a few days ago....

Sue, if you're that focused and organized to rattle off that long, succinct post on your way out the door to work, I envy your Boss having an employee like you! Or ~ maybe you ARE the boss!

Yes, eBay makes sense as advertising. As Jared says, where can you find another single-mindedly, focused group with world-wide exposure for less than $30?

When I began to make a permanent presence for myself I knew that I wouldn't get my retail price (as after 12 years at shows, comp work, mag features) because I was unknown and photos are certainly deceiving. Until you get your work into customers hands, they have no way of knowing if the seams show, trims are likely to disintegrate or eyes and other notions pop off.
Another European friend says to consider your beginning periods in any new venture/venue/market as paying a tuition to learn a new skill, not unlike any other tuition you'd pay to study a year's course or take several workshops. In this case the 'paid tuition' is the loss of a larger income per item. As Kathy says, if you clear your expenses, that's the best you should expect in the early days.

Ellen, I've never paid the extra $20 for Featured Plus. I've been debating this - can you tell me something (which I'm sure is in the Selling Features explanations but I manage to get sidetracked every time I enter eBay... LOL): do the Featured Plus items stay at the top of EVERY page in that category or only the first page? If the former is true then I don't think it's worth it, otherwise I might soon consider it.

The world has changed and for a while I was not willing to change with it. In 2005 I stopped making bears and tried working at a "real job"    
Yeah, that was a joke. So I decide to give my bears one last chance and I gave eBay a try.

Kathy (and I still have your 5" rust mink bear from the old S.M.A.L.L. days) this was how I felt when I had to give up shows after 12 years. Time to re-group. I knew I'd be online but didn't then know quite where my main focus would be. (It's sure good that I wasn't relying on a web presence as you all know my tale of woes there!! LOL)

I have had many more disastrous fairs than auctions. My disaster auctions did not cost me nearly as much as some of the fairs I attended and sold nothing at all

So true. Jared listed most of the expenses and down time that I was referring to.

when I listed them at their reserve price as a starting price later, I did sell them. If you are not yet well-known on EBay, then how will the collectors there know what your prices are.... I do think this can be totally different for established EBay sellers, that have sold for many years and have therefore been able to ''educate'' the buyers what their prices are. I can give you an example of a TITA nominated bear that I sold recently. He had been on EBay before with a low starting price with reserve, it ended up not selling...a lot of bids, but bidding ended at a 5th of the normal retail price. I relisted him and started the bidding on the reserve price and it sold straight away....less bids, but a sale...I have had this happen numerous times and therefore do not like reserve auctions anymore.

Hmm, food for thought. It's the opposite of Karen's thinking about ~

I, also, feel the point is to get many bids and get collectors participating and excited about the auction. OK, I'll admit maybe I'm old-fashioned. Maybe eBay is nothing like a real auction?

Bingo! Nothing like real auctions; everything goes home with someone at a 'regular' auction!

Reserve Prices, a whole other topic:

As a buyer I do not bid on bears by artists not known by me with reserve prices. I do not know what they would like to have and am certainly not going to try to see what it will be. I do not like guessing.

Has anyone ever written to ask you what your reserve is? I have and if it's a customer that bids seriously and regularly or wins auctions, I will tell them. To me that's no more or less than turning over the price tag so it can be seen on a bear in person at a show.

And I'm a little put off when an auction starts at the reserve?! First I wonder what the artist expects in price when they start at $400?

I've always felt that prices like those belong on a regular website, which then acts as an online show table.

Photography is not my strong point and it seems that it does not matter what I do with my camera it has a slight blur most of the time!! possible wobbley hand syndrome I think

These images are all equally 'blurred as you called them, rather than part of the bear being in focus & part out (which would need depth-of-field and aperture priority choices.) I wonder if you're just getting in closer to your subject than your camera allows for?  A few inches can make a great difference in crisp images.
For close-ups, when you don't have or aren't comfortable using close-up and macro features, it's better to take a sharp focus a little farther away from the subject (leve more space around the edges, and bring the image in close by cropping or selecting parts of the image in a photo editing software on your camera.'I have to do this because the detail of some polar bears is lost if I'm in macro mode so I move out to take the pix and then crop them in Photoshop.

I do my homework, viewing all lists for the thing I want, I look at postage costs, feedback and what I am getting for my money
I make sure they accept paypal (can't wait to get item and the only time I paid by cheque the seller did not send or cash cheque!!)
If no postage given I do not bid

Me, too: postage stated, Paypal only unless it's the bargain of the century, and both sides of their feedback. I just passed on an excellent pair of black pearl earrings (bidding ended and item was not sold) because postage and shipping from China was over @24. I felt like reporting them to eBay as gouging like this is not allowed.  Postage has gone up (especially overseas) but really, .... something this small and light?

But in the meantime, my work also attracted the attention of collectors who could not afford to compete with the high bidding but they put their names on my mailing list anyway. For those collectors, I now create and sell my limited edition bears and animals...which have been selling as soon as I post them.

I like this idea Kathy, as not everyone can compete for my top-of-the-line work. It's hard to create a product though that meets certain standards (which account for the labor=$ spent on a piece) but could sell in a lower range. Berta Hesen-Minten does this; she even has a separate name for this category of her work. It's more reasonable to expect that in crocheted mini bears than in Needle Felting, as I won't give up or shorten the length of time spent needling. Simpler shapes and designs will be the only option, much like my kit lines which have always been solid foundation but less complex in design than my retail work.

(With eBay I usually start at $100.00 because of this special case where if you start too low you piece will be FAR back in the pages).

This was an interesting point Karen, as I realized you were referring to the choices of how to search within a category. I've never looked at any item in any category other than Newly Listed or Ending Soonest. I'd quite forgotten that they're also listed by high & low pricing.

As a separate topic, I wonder which is the favorite or most used search category, at least in the Bear World??

The only problem with reserves is that the odd one or two people will bid til they reach the reserve then retract their bid and the number of times that I have sold something that has just reached its reserve if often, a lot assume (psychologically) that the reserve is the value of the item and its not worth more

I guess I've just been fortunate to've never experienced a retracted bid...

Pay day has a great effect on ebay

Fortunately these are such a flex-time work days, there is no such thing as a once-a-week-on-Friday or a 15th & the 30th paydays any more. Every day is Pay Day for someone!

OK - Here's where I really step out on a lonely limb: don't everyone rush for a bow saw!!

I have come to the conclusion that the thrill of the chase appeals to a large amount of people and for a few days they are the potential owner, the next person who bids then feels that they are stealing it form the original bidder, as I said before I am the ruthless one who says HA!!

if I see something that is started low and not much action on it (and I want it!) then I will bid and once I have bid it is like I have already started thinking about owning it and will keep bidding far past what I would have just passed by if it were started at that price to begin with. So there is something about getting people started on bidding and then they don't like to quit! (Like maybe just one more bid will get it for you - whether it is an online auction or a live auction!)
I am a last minute bidder as well, I like it when the item looks unnoticed (no bids),

I don't care if there are no bidders on that item, I prefer it if there is non (no competition)

Sheep follow each other, I have often wondered and seen a sudden rise in a price days before bidding has ended,

Buyers who view an item or ask questions very rarely buy

1 - when I buy I bid in the last few seconds (bargain queen)
Once short listed I view items on and off for awhile before deciding which one I really want


Ellen, Sue, Edie and all - I eSnipe.
To me (with a low tolerance for Risk-taking) it's a deal that I make with myself. Any other bidders come into the auction only peripherally: if they raise the bidding beyond my budget.
I too, see anything anywhere and make an instant decision - "Yes, it's going home with me." "No. I don't like/want it." and only after think "Oh, and what's the price?"
As soon as the decision is made, I know what my top price will be. It's the same thing as eBay's own Proxy Bids, except no one else knows I'm interested (remember the sheep theory again) so there's a likelihood that it'll stay below others' radar-scope range. But the biggest point I need to make is the bargain-with-myself. I know how much of my budget can go for items that will fit into my life; once I make the decision, I place my bet and forget about it. No second-guessing myself or maybe-just-a-bit-more-will-win-it..... 99% of the time I bid I win using this and about 80-% of those times it's at the opening bid price or far below what it might've risen to with a few other bidders mixed in. If I bid high enough to begin with, I'll win no matter what others do.
As a Seller of course, this doesn't show interest in my goods (nor ruthlessly-stated - not gain as high a selling price for me but I balance that against not having had to pay out as much for what I want from others and feel that it all equals out in the end!), but most of us recognize that most bidding goes on in the last 10 minutes.

OK, I'm done.

In conclusion I have decided that I am not the normal ebay buyer

LOL - none of us are, that's what makes this so thrilling for those among us that allow a certain amount of Risk into their Lives!!!

Perhaps the best closing, Kathy's -

So now I have my life as a Teddy Bear Artist "before eBay" and my life as a Teddy Bear Artist "after eBay" .... it's very different. I spent a lot of time on the computer now...but my new eBay collectors have been very very good to me. 

I truly feel blessed.

Thx for sticking w/me long enough to read this....
My opinions only here.....

sarahjane Jun 3, 2007

I haven't really got anything more to add to this topic but I did want to say how much I am enjoying everyones responses.

Bobbie I always find your answers to things so informative and well thought out!!!

FenBeary Folk Jun 3, 2007

Bobbie

Bravo, Bravo

Ps I work for a firm of accountants, very organised, my house is a mess though :crackup: