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desertmountainbear Jul 31, 2009

This is a question that has been on my mind for a long time.  It is a question that I hope will get some response from the collectors here as well as the artists.   
For a long time I sold bears on ebay for a very low start price no reserve.  I was always happy with the money that I received, always sold the bear, no problems.  Then the economy fell apart.  I watch auctions all the time.  I notice that in the bear world most people start at a low price and use a reserve.  The auctions with the high start prices don't seem to get many bids.  I have been using a reserve lately, I feel like I would rather not sell it, than sell it for an amount that I am unhappy with, which may happen in this economy. 
My husband has a very successful ebay business, he says people don't like to bid with reserves. I should just start the bidding 30% less than what I want.  Every bear I list I go through this anxiety, reserve, no reserve.  Let is go, price it high.  Oh I am confused.

As artist, and as collectors what are the feelings about this.

Joanne

KJ Lyons Jul 31, 2009

Joanne,
Our business is so different from any other eBay business! I do believe it really hurts your sale if you start out too high. I think I understand the buyer's thoughts? Sometimes it feels like the artist is expecting a very high auction price and they are letting you know by their high first bid price. But I think we do have to have a reserve. I generally have a reserve that is about 25% under my show price so a buyer can get a bargain but at the same time I can afford the sale. So far this has worked very well for me 
Karen
KJ Lyons Design

desertmountainbear Jul 31, 2009

Thank you Karen, I really appreciate your input.
Joanne

dangerbears Jul 31, 2009

Joanne, I agree with Karen on this one.

When people are bargain-hunting on eBay, a low start price with no reserve can really generate interest. (I know when I'm bargain-hunting, I often won't bother to bid if there's a reserve.)

With an artist bear, I think people have an idea what it costs. Some of the low bidders might not, or some might put in a bid as a show of appreciation -- not really expecting to win, but helping to move the bidding along.

In this economy, a reserve is just sensible, and if the bear is very special (as all of yours are), one or two collectors are probably willing to pay a fair price.

Any thoughts on the Buy It Now option? Do you think that's a good alternative in some cases?

Becky

brightbears Jul 31, 2009

It would make me very unhappy to see my bears go for an adoption fee way below my 'normal' prices, and I also do not like reserve prices. I start with a price that is just enough to make me happy, but still about 20% lower than my website prices. Sometimes I use the Buy It Now option, I feel it is more fair than a secret reserve price. I had only a few sales where collectors used Buy It Now, so it is not the success I hoped, but at least they knew what the maximum price was and they could decide if that was good for them. Reserve prices are just not my thing, I guess.

Collectors can get a Bright Bear cheaper by waiting for it to appear on eBay, and it has worked about 100 times. I must admit that since October last year adoptions have slowed down, and I see other bear makers sometimes still sell by using low prices (often without reserves). I am sorry to say that USD $49 or something like it is just not enough to make me part with my creations, I'd rather keep them in my own collection until times have changed then.

I am happy to hear how you are all working with prices, I mean, we know we need all the input we can get to reach the fabulous collectors around the globe...

danceswithteddybears Jul 31, 2009

I'm not selling on ebay right now, though I have and will again.  The economy is just too iffy.   But since it's a buyers market, I do still buy.  So I'll approach this as a buyer/collector.
I don't at all like reserves.  It has to be something really special for me to return to a reserve auction.  Buy it Now is okay, if the price is right. That doesn't mean it has to be cheap, just appropriate for the item being sold.  One of the things I buy/collect is art pottery and if the price is fair, and I want the piece, I'll buy it.  But if I see a reserve I assume they want a ridiculous amount for their wares and split.  Their reserve might be reasonable, but I don't stay to find out.  Not fair, I know, but honest.  If an item has a reasonable starting bid, which doesn't mean rock bottom low, I watch it or put in a bid.
I know art pottery isn't quite in the same ball park as artist bears, but buyers think like buyers no matter what they're buying.  Well, almost.  Especially in times like these.  And yes, they want a bargain whenever, and wherever, they can find one.
I hope this helps a little.  Even though I buy, I'm too frustrated right now to be selling on ebay.
  :hug:

Off The Paw Jul 31, 2009

A good few of my friends all stay away from ebay auctions that have reserves, it just puts them off for some reason. I think its different with artist bears though, and feel that most people understand when the auction is for a hand made creation that many hours of work have been invested in. I normally just put a starting bid of a price I'm happy to sell at, and sometimes add a buy now price which has worked well for me in the past.  It does cause me a bit of indecision every time though!

Lhearn Jul 31, 2009

I have always struggled with this as well. By the time you ask for a fair price for the creation and not have a reserve but still have to consider all the fees that must come off that price......so there for you would have to have a reserve or start off higher wouldn't you? I have been watching ebay to see how the bears are selling and they are few and far between compared to the amount that is out there for sale.

I think that if a collector whats that piece enough the reserve is not an issue, but on the other hand there are collecters that are looking for a bagain or starting out collecting bears and can only go so far as on how much they can afford to pay. I think alot has to do with what you are selling on ebay to what realy works. Just my thought on it. May be some collectore can best answer this.

Jellybelly Bears Jul 31, 2009

Hmmm, I just list at my desired price, and if it goes higher thats wonderful, it works pretty well but I don't get heaps of bids as the price is already higher.  I've never used a reserve.....

desertmountainbear Jul 31, 2009

Thanks for all your input.  I did use a buy it now as well as a reserve a couple of times and I sold it now, but I did notice there wasn't as much bidding.   Also how about stating your reserve somewhere, or do you leave it a mystery?
Joanne

Lhearn Jul 31, 2009

I to have used a buy it now a couple of times as well as low start and a reserve and the bears sold. I think the economy.   has a lot to do with sell right on. Lets hope that it picks up for every one.

Joanne when you say you start off as say 30% less then what the bear should be, have you already added in the fees from ebay and paypal to the price? one would haave to add these fees into the price as well or you have priced the bear 30% lower and then you would have to take off the fees from that price as well.....then you would be down another say 10%, so now you would be down 40%. I think as a byer we forget that it cost the seller to sell their items on ebay with all the fees and it is not getting any cheaper. If you sell from your web site you would not have to pay for these fees but you get better exposure for ebay.

desertmountainbear Jul 31, 2009

Joanne when you say you start off as say 30% less then what the bear should be, have you already added in the fees from ebay and paypal to the price? one would haave to add these fees into the price as well or you have priced the bear 30% lower and then you would have to take off the fees from that price as well.....then you would be down another say 10%, so now you would be down 40%. I think as a byer we forget that it cost the seller to sell their items on ebay with all the fees and it is not getting any cheaper. If you sell from your web site you would not have to pay for these fees but you get better exposure for ebay.

Hi Linda, I don't really ever take ebay fees into account, I should, but I consider the money spent there as advertising.  That is why I still sell on ebay for the advertising value.   I have not really sold anything off my website yet.  I do not feel I have the customer base to do that.  I am working on the more exposure thing now, maybe then I can get to that point.  I sure hope so.
Joanne

Jaina Jul 31, 2009

As both an eBay seller and buyer, I do not like reserves.I find it frustrating when I want to bid, I always put in the maximum amount I am willing to pay. I don't snipe or bid last second (unless I decide that I really, really have to have it). It is frustrating to bid on an item to find out that your bid is not enough to touch the reserve. So I rarely will bid on reserve items unless i'm totally in love with it.

I always sell by listing it at the minimum price I am willing to let an item go at (often a bit less than what I would like to achieve) because that way, it is transparent and open to the buyer what I want.

Having said that, when I start listing bears for sale, I will probably start the price at the materials cost, so at least I am not making a loss - but that is more to do with the fact I do not have an identity within the bear world and hopefully, getting my bears out there will raise my profile.

I am perhaps not your typical collector as I only own 5 (no 6 on the way!) artist bears. Only one of those I paid the artists regular price for. I love to appreciate the art/work of others, but cannot afford many artist's regular price (those prices are totally fair taking into account time and materials etc). So for me, eBay is the place that I buy most of my bears. I tend to put in minimum-ish bids and hope I get lucky - occasionally I do!

I for one, would love to own one of your bears Joanne, and I hope they bring you high prices - but I could only afford it if no-one else bid in most cases. I'm not a serious collector; just someone who likes to rehome the odd bear 

Little_Bearries Jul 31, 2009

I agree with your husband on skipping the reserve price.

As a buyer I've always been really baffled and annoyed by reserve prices.
I mean, I understand the idea of making it look like it's starting low to encourage bidding... but people are onto that schtick... and it's annoying to not just know what the reserve is so you can start there.

I've bid on several auctions with reserves... and I bid around market value, but I still hadn't met the reserve, and after two attempts to guess what it might possibly be, I give up bidding all together. I just hate playing that game... the seller *knows* what they want for it... and I want to know too, so I can bid appropriately and not have to enter six million different amounts.

Plus, at least in the past, a reserve price actually costs you additional fees... which stinks.

I've tried reserve prices on a few of my auctions as well... just to see if it encouraged bidding... and it didn't. I got fewer bids and had to field a ton of questions about "Well... what IS your reserve price, anyways?"

desertmountainbear Jul 31, 2009

I agree with your husband on skipping the reserve price.

I've tried reserve prices on a few of my auctions as well... just to see if it encouraged bidding... and it didn't. I got fewer bids and had to field a ton of questions about "Well... what IS your reserve price, anyways?"

Thank you all for your responses.  I will have to mull this over. 

This leads me back to do you state your reserve?  I have been putting the reserve price on my website, and directing people here and on bear pile to my website for more info on the reserve.  I have not stated the reserve price on ebay.   I almost think it would scare anyone but the most serious collectors away. When I watch auctions I do look to see who is getting lots of bids, I don't know why, I guess to me it means people are loving the bear.  It's all part of the excitment of an ebay auction, I really like to watch them.

peterbear Jul 31, 2009

Hi Joanne,

I have bought several bears on e-bay, though mainly manufactured (Steiff) bears.
I too am not very happy about auctions with reserves.

Here is what I do if come across one :
- I place my bid with, what I consider to be, a fair price for the bear.
- If the reserve is not met, I contact the seller and just ask him/her how much the reserve is (just like Little Bearies  ) ; so far no-one has refused to give me the reserve price.
- Then I decide if I want to bid above the reserve price.

However I do prefer an auction with the "buy it now" option.  The way I see it, this has two advantages for me as a buyer :
- Either I am very keen to have the bear and then I will gladly pay the price the seller has proposed, so I buy it immediately : BIG ADVANTAGE -> I am certain the bear is mine !!
- Or I would like to have the bear, but don't consider it a "must have" and then I make a bid, considering how much I want to spend on the bear.  If the bidding goes higher, so much the better for the seller, but then I'm out.

I have another problem with e-bay though : when you are searching for Steiff or Hermann or Merrythought teddies: no problem.
But when I want to find real OOAK artist bears, I always get a lot of results that don't match what I am looking for.  Is there a good way to search for real artists bears?

Hugs,  :hug:

Peterbear

brightbears Jul 31, 2009

Peterbear, thank you for telling us about the buyers' view of eBay auctions.

If you want to search for bears, you could try to browse the categories. Mine are always in Dolls & Bears > Bears > Artist > One of a Kind, but you could take it one step less deep and stay in the Dolls & Bears > Bears > Artist category, I think you will find beautiful stuff that way, and this is how I follow many many auctions of other artists for years.

desertmountainbear Jul 31, 2009

Thank you Peter, I really appreciate you responding.  To search for the ooak artist bears, Bright Bears has it right.  Search in that specific catagory.  I also watch esellerstreet to see who is selling what.  But the problem there is the item won't come up unless there is a bid.
Joanne

KJ Lyons Jul 31, 2009

I believe a reserve price shows that an artist is professional about their business. All fine art auctions maintain reserves on their pieces that are up for sale. Besides, who can take that loss if their art is their income? Also I think starting low does add excitement and bids to an auction and bids effect your rating with eBay. I frequently look at the number of bids a piece is receiving and I'll click on an auction with a lot of bidders to see what's going on It does make me sad to see a wonderful bear sell for a very low price. I'd feel just as bad if I had won the bear at a low price. I always wish the artist would have respected their work enough to put a reserve price on their piece? It is also deadly for known artists; too many low priced sales and some collectors will worry about their collection's value. But we are many different sellers on ebay and some are hobbyist or just want to get whatever they can for a piece and are not concerned about the final price. There's room for all of us, and buyers for all types of sales 
Karen

Melisa Nichols Aug 1, 2009

I agree with Karen... my creations typically take me a week or more to create, so even with a $500 reserve, that still doesn't pay much for my time.  By starting the price lower, it gives me an idea of what people are willing to pay for a particular piece and whether there is any point relisting it if it doesn't sell the first time.  I'm always agonizing over this too, I don't think there is any way to have a clear cut answer - there are so many variables.  The buy-it-now option sometimes works for me, but I'm always worried about where to set it.  If I price it at what I think it's worth, given my time, will others think it is too high?  If I price it lower, am I going to be happy with the price? 

If it doesn't work the first time, there's always a relisting option - sometimes the collector who would love your bear happens to be on holidays the first time. 

desertmountainbear Aug 1, 2009

Thanks Melisa,  I appreciate your input.  I have decided with everyones help to keep listing with a reserve.  At this time it is what feels right in my gut, and I have learned to trust those feelings.
Joanne

artbyrjandreae Aug 1, 2009

Hi Joanne,
I agree with Karen & Melisa.  I started using a reserve at the beginning of summer. I used to start my items really low with no reserve and would watch to see what would happen.  In the past the final bid amount always seemed fair.  When summer hit, the final bid amount was less than half of what I thought was fair. I also got very worried that if the buyers saw my art and hardwork going for pennies on the dollar, it might devalue my work in the future.  So, I experimented. I tried a reserve and a high starting bid. The items with the high starting bid went for less money than the reserve priced items. So the reserve stuck.  I mention my reserve price in my blog, that way I get my customers to follow my blog. I hope eventually to start previewing my work to my regulars on my blog and allowing them to purchase before the item goes to eBay. I just need to get my readership up first.

desertmountainbear Aug 1, 2009

Thanks Robin for commenting.  It is nice to hear how you have tried it all, and what is working for you.
Joanne

jenny Aug 2, 2009

I usually start my auctions at a $100 with a reserve price. It's not a game, it's to protect the time and effort that I spend on making my bears which form a major part of my livelhood and so the reason I put a reserve price on the pieces is not to fool people, actually these days I will happily tell people the reserve if they ask me, but I have to have a safety net, a price which is acceptable to me...but is generally the bare minimum I would charge for such a bear given the time, expenses, and the profit I need to make it worthwhile.
I do not make bears JUST for fun though it IS fun and I count myself lucky.
This time however I have removed the safety net from my latest eBay bear...this may prove to be a mistake...but that's my choice and I rightly or wrongly I decided to chance it on this particular piece.

I think a lower starting price does attract more attention from buyers, who we all know are absolutely not suckers but there has to be a profit in it for me or I can't do it anymore. So that's the bottom line.

In the market we are all in at the moment it's clear that we have to protect our businesses to get through this time, which is why I still do my 'other' job and let's face it this malaise will lift .....eventually!!!

desertmountainbear Aug 2, 2009

Thank you Jenny,  I am happy to hear your thoughts on this.  You are one of the people whose auctions I watch.  There is always a lot of bidding an excitment around your bears. 
Joanne