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Just wondering what people think about this. I was browsing bear websites the other day and came across 'Reborn' teddies...apparently the bears get a makeover. These aren't particularly old bears...they seem to be artist bears. I am not sure if it's a good thing or not. Would you buy an artist bear thta has been made over by another artist?
How would you feel about another artist changing one of your bears? I actually think from the artists point of view it's something I don't think I'd like really because it's a bit of a cheek...that said I can see why it seems like a good way to put bears out quickly and fairly easily and don't blame them for having a new slant on bear making. After all doll artists have been re-borning for years.
Interested to hear your thoughts.......
Newcastle, OntarioJenny,
I've not come across that yet, but I don't think I'd like people changing my bears either! I know what I want when I make my bears and I'd like them to be able to live out their days like that.
hugs,
Brenda
Dolls N DreamsI have not seen this, but I don' t think I would like it 
DoodlebearsI don't think much of that Jenny. After all the person who made the bear in the first place would be upset to think their bear was seen as needing a make over and the person that had done the make over would be making a profit from someone elses work. Reborning a doll is another mater, they are manufactured dolls and a mostly made for reborning. No I don't think much of that one!
Hugs, Jane. 
Have you got a link to the site Jenny I would love a look?
Posts: 94Just wondering what people think about this. I was browsing bear websites the other day and came across 'Reborn' teddies...apparently the bears get a makeover. These aren't particularly old bears...they seem to be artist bears. I am not sure if it's a good thing or not. Would you buy an artist bear thta has been made over by another artist?
How would you feel about another artist changing one of your bears? I actually think from the artists point of view it's something I don't think I'd like really because it's a bit of a cheek...that said I can see why it seems like a good way to put bears out quickly and fairly easily and don't blame them for having a new slant on bear making. After all doll artists have been re-borning for years.
Interested to hear your thoughts.......
That is an interesting subject to talk to.
First thought that comes to my mind is :
If I am the maker , I sold the bear I have created at the normal price I wanted, without discount, then once the bear is sold, the buyer do anything with. The buyer being the new owner may decide to resell the bear under another maker name than the initial one, it is allowed even if it does not sound nice to do, after all it is not my business anymore.
If the buyer manages to resell the bear under another name than mine , I would wonder : Do I sell my bear at the right price ?
If the buyer manages to resell the bear under another name than mine I also would think : The person is cleverer than me to promote its business.
So, from this I could decide to try to improve my way of communication in order to promote my work better and to sell my bear more expensive.
Some people are able to create wonderful teddy bear but they haven't got any idea of the way they could sell them.
Some people are able to sell everything "all made" but they haven't got the ability of creating anything.
Once a bear is sold, it is not possible to decide what it is going to be made with the bear. A teddy bear maker can't get the bear's life, money from the sale and decision of what the bear is going to become lol It is a choice to make before 
Eric
Woodbury Park BearsI have seen on BearPile teddies that have been "reborn" with before and after shots they don't look like artist bears though but manufactured. As an artist I would be saddened to think that a bear I have designed and created was to end up under someone elses hand. 
Raewyn
Hmmm...not sure if you could actually claim you made a bear if you didn't. I know that some people 'make over' vintage bears...so in fact they repair them, but a reborn bear without so much as a cursory nod to the original artist is not playing fair. I know people can do what they like with bears once they buy them..I am not worried about that aspect really...because once they are sold they do belong to some one else, but people don't own the original design, nor do they have a right to sell it on in another form or under another name .What is being done here is that the look of the bear is being changed ...not just cleaned and spruced up. I think that sprucing up a tired looking bear is one thing...but completley remodelling is another.
Emo BearsThat is really sad I could kind of understand people individualising a mass manufactured bear (or anything, I have seen some awesome things done to littlest pet shop animals)
But I think it's wrong to change an artist bear - after all - aren't artist bears fundamently about being a unique? (or low edition, I only like to buy OOAK individuals, I don't mean not from the same pattern, I mean exactly the same bear) and part of a unique vision by the artist - not someone's elses interpretation of how that bear should be. I buy because I like the artist's work and the artists vision.
I wonder if there is a market in this? if this people make any money from it Or if they do it simply to reduce their losses on a bear - after all, a second hand artist bear often looses a LOT! of money on the original purchase price as we discussed elsewhere.
It is true that once you sell a bear, you loose the right to decide what is done with it - but itdoesn't mean you have to like what is done!
desertmountainbearI do not like of that idea done with an artist bear. But with a manufactured bear, for us artists, just think of the possibilities. For me the designing and sewing is not where the fun is. It is in the detailing, the needle scultpting, the shading, and trimming,and the felting.
I think it would be fun to transform a nicely made, but plain manufactured bear into something more.
Joanne
Back Road BearsEric has a good point but that doesn't make what Jenny is describing "ethical" or respectful to the original artist.
As far as I'm concerned this is right up there with outright copying. If you can't be original and do your own dirty work and have to disrespect a real artist's unique creativity then............ well...........
And yeah, I bet a lot of us have seen a handmade bear and thought "he needs a little more trimmed here, some shading there, his limbs are attached crooked etc. but to actually buy, alter and resell as your own!!! Shame!
Just my opinion! 
EJ's CraftsI am with Joanne, a true artist bear should be left alone but to take a manufactured bear and make it better would be lots of fun and think of the possibilities. I sometimes will go to the thrift shops and buy manufactured bears to try new techniques on. It sure saves me time and money to try it on an old bear than to design and make a bear which could end up in the garbage. So if everything turns out well on one of these bears then why not call them reborn and sell them. I think though that it should be stated how these bears started out and not called artist bears.
Eric,
That is dangerous as to copyright laws. Every artist's work under current law in the USA is automatically covered by the copyright law. Defacing or changing parts of a piece does not negate the copyright law. THe artist still owns the copyright. I guarantee that a larger company will go after a reborn artist if that person gets large enough to be noticed by them. The doll reborn artists get away with it because these doll companies have sanctioned the reborning of their dolls.
Karen Lyons
KJ Lyons Design
Posts: 94Eric has a good point but that doesn't make what Jenny is describing "ethical" or respectful to the original artist.
As far as I'm concerned this is right up there with outright copying. If you can't be original and do your own dirty work and have to disrespect a real artist's unique creativity then............ well...........
And yeah, I bet a lot of us have seen a handmade bear and thought "he needs a little more trimmed here, some shading there, his limbs are attached crooked etc. but to actually buy, alter and resell as your own!!! Shame!
Just my opinion! :P
I am with you Daphne, I did not get all the first post.
Taking everything into consideration, I agree it is not a correct way to act especially if the "second hand artist" put only its name after a cloth changed on a bear or an hat added... It then would make a false artist and a liar too.
Now, something else (I hope I can correctly write what I mean lol) : if someone buys a bear to an artist, then put its touch as change for the better and then sells the bear and describes as for example : Eric's Bear reworked by X's Retouching, it then becomes an honest way (I know I am again nearly out of subject lol). I have never heard of this does it exist ?
Eric
I have to say I still think...even if you do mention the artists name I think it would be very wrong to re-work the bear without permission of the original artist. I don't even think a maufactured bear would be saleable after an 'artist makeover'. I think it is fine to do it for your own benefit...but not to sell. How about Barbie makeovers..how do they get around the copyright? Is it ok because they still say it's 'Barbie'?
It's a really interesting one!!
Eric,
IT would only be OK if the artist had given a written agreement. BUt I doubt any artist would give such an agreement. Collectors of this artist's work would worry about the value of their collection if someone is reworking that artist's work.
Karen
P.S. Jenny, Mattel has given permission for some Barbie remake events. But you can bet there are many "Cease and Desist" letters out there. Toy companies are tough! They know you can't afford to go up against their lawyers.
Posts: 94Hello again
I have tried to think of an example of re-working, the only one I found is about singers who give the right to modify their songs, I believe they call it "remix" and it works well but it is nothing to do with teddy bears though 
Eric
White Forest BearsOMG I would totally FREAK if that happened to one of our bears.
Benson BearsDidn't someone give the link to this a while back? I remember visiting the site. Actually I think it was on The Guild of Master Bear Crafters, come to think of it. I remember her making a big deal about deodorising the bears before reworking them!!!!!! I just think she has a lot of gall to do this.......... making the assumption that she's making things "better". I don't know the circumstances and maybe she has the original artists' permission in which case it's ok, though I think she should acknowledge that person and from memory she doesn't. If it was happening to my bears I think I would have something to say!!!!!
Pennsylvania
Sending a Bear to the Bear Hospital to get his paws patched, his nose resewn or some other kind of repair is okay.
If the Bear wants new clothes, it would be okay to make him a new outfit. But you have to ask the Bear first!
He would, of course, want to keep his old clothes some place safe so he could wear them again if he changed his mind.
(Bears often change their minds, dont'cha know! 
)
However, sending a Bear in for unwanted, unnecessary surgery without his consent is ABUSE! Plain and simple!
Any human who would dare do something like this to a Teddy Bear is NOT a friend to Bears! We don't even want to know who they are! (Except so that we may walk a wide circle around them!)
Bears may be small but, humans be warned! Do you remember what happened to Gulliver? You had better watch your step or else you might get a taste of what he got!
"Reborn" Bears? Whoever heard of such a thing? It's an OUTRAGE, we say!
Little Bear GuyI find it very interesting that this is just coming up now. There is an "artist" who now is designing her own bears I think. But previously she would buy bears and rework them, some were maufactured bears. She just did a rework on them, and these bears sold on ebay for huge dollars, I don't know why anyone would buy one but collectors gobbled them up. I think it's really no different then when artist have bears made offshore, but you have to read tags closely because you as a collector would think the bear was made by the artist, but it just says "finished by ...." or whatever but the artist did not even touch the bear.
I can't say I would want it done to one of my bears, but I will bet it's going to start happening more and more. Karen not sure if we are automatically copy righted in Canada. I do believe we have have to apply for copy right.
White Forest BearsCould someone PM me a link to these? I'm so curious!
Bears by EdieI first came across "reborn" bears on Bear Pile a couple months ago and posted the topic on Guild of Master Bear Crafters but got no response so deleted it as I thought no one else was interested. I know we have no control over what happens to our bears once we sell them but I think most artists would find it a bit distressing to have one their creations be the subject of one of these "reworking" of bears. I have had the experience of having someone buy one of my bears and strip away all the accessories and props and then resell it using my name as the artist and this didn't make me very happy as she was saying it was my bear but I really didn't feel it was after she had removed all the accessories. At least the person I saw doing "reborn" bears didn't use the artists names which I think is a good thing and she did state that they were artist bears that she had changed so I guess if people wanted to buy them knowing that, there isn't anything anyone can do about it - no false pretenses at any rate!
P.S. I've PMed you a link Erin!
Bubble Up Bears!I know I will NEVER buy a reworked "artist bear".
To me it would be like buying a Van Gogh painting knowing it has been altered by a painter named George and he decided it needed an ear instead of a bandage. Any altering of the original is of no value to me. It only takes away of the artists' original concept, creation.
There is surely more pride involved in selling your own work ??
I would want the credit for all my own work and not share it with someone else.
If you can do noses and trimming and shading and eyes then this is actually some of the more skilled areas of bear artistry and is what makes your bear individual.
Is it just a case of avoiding the sometimes less exciting parts of bearmaking like cutting out, trimming seems, stuffing etc ??
